Business Changes

Its more important what you say no to in life than what you say yes to. When we went open source, we stared at google analytics every day and rejoiced when we passed 100 visits a day. Now we average 10,000 visits in a day and were the fastest growing open source CMS out there. In the early days we were just flattered that anyone cared, so wed bend over backwards to provide any service we could to anyone who asked. As time went on, we tried out different ideas and dumped a few that turned out to be mistakes or just past their prime (pro accounts, support incidents to name just two). Were banking on 5.7 being a pretty big deal, so to make sure were positioned correctly to support and promote it, were focusing on a few things:

  1. No more budget hosting. To stay the size I want we have to choose where to put our hosting expertise, and were focusing on the big boys. Theres plenty of budget hosts willing to do a great job helping people get started with concrete5. Were going to have the free hosting with ads at, and those ads are going to suggest you get a paid hosting account to get rid of the ads. I dont expect to make much of anything on the ads (who knows) but I expect to make a lot on the hosting signup commissions.This would be awesome for us as it would help me track ROI on marketing spends.
  2. Enterprise Support SLAs. Since launching the enterprise site weve already sold a few of these guys with great success.
  3. Training. This is the #1 priority for growing the project. Weve got to offer more training in more ways and get certification working. Were seeing huge system integrators looking for ways to train 1000 developers on concrete5, and what weve got today is only now starting to meet that need.
  4. Services. Were still helping a handful of clients with concrete5. We like having our feet in the water so to speak, as we believe it gives us insight into ways the tools need to improve. Theres an old sales adage of you can have it fast, cheap, and well done - now pick 1 (or 2). It strikes me that we should be expensive and perfectly done. The more we move in that direction, the more room there is for the community to move up and be reasonably priced, fast, well done.
  5. The marketplace. For 2-3 years I talked about very little beyond the marketplace when people asked us how we were going to make money. I always got inquisitive looks when I was speaking to well informed folks, but I was passionate about it nevertheless. I believe weve made a more powerful solution to the module/add-on problem than all of our competition has today. I believe the PRB and community curated aspect of our marketplace is a key component to our projects success, and will always remain so. So many of us have been burned by Drupal modules that break other modules, or Wordpress add-ons that just dont work. Bringing the barrier to entry up a bit and using Apples App store as a guide was a good idea and I have no regrets about it.
    That being said, there are some real issues with it being the primary or only revenue model:
    1. Practically speaking, it has been flat for us for some time. Its just very dependable income each month but it never explodes and it doesnt seem to be that directly connected to our site traffic or demo signups. Practically the marketplace is not our primary revenue model today. Marketplace net profits cover of our monthly operating burn rate.
    2. We cant sell enterprise stuff there. People are outraged when we price an internationalization suite at $1,750 in the marketplace, but when I tell people through that our enterprise suite costs $250k for an unlimited license no one blinks an eye. Moreover any enterprise that might want to grab a simple add-on out of there instantly has support issues. A large organization needs one point of contact for support issues and is willing to pay for that. Since we really cant promise failsafe support on add-ons we didnt create, even with the PRB, its often difficult for the big boys to see the marketplace as anything more than a nice prototyping perk.
    3. Its a turnoff for the moral high ground open source crowd. The fact that were MIT licensed instead of GPL is already a hard sell for some open source advocates, and then they look at our marketplace and exclaim that all the good stuff costs money! I can (and do) argue that actually about half the stuff in there is free and you can buy stuff for Wordpress/Drupal/Joomla too. We just took the effort to make a curated destination with support and refund policies, but it still rubs folks the wrong way at a glance - and that is what it is. If someone thinks you smell, it doesnt matter if you know you dont from their position, you smell. The idea of making something and selling it in the marketplace tends to appeal to the 1-2 man entrepreneurial cowboy webshop looking for different ways to augment their services revenue with something more dependable. Speaking as someone in that camp, I think thats great. Speaking as the leader of a open source project with the goal of being a ubiquitous building material for the web, I wonder if we may be letting ourselves get unfairly compared to more truly open source offerings out there by always saying the marketplace is our primary revenue concern.
    4. Our own add-ons are priced in a way to try to cover the costs of developing the core. What ends up happening is our add-ons arent as good as they could be, because revenue that should be going back into improving them gets funneled into time on the core. We have too many small things in there which require too much support expertise. It also makes tracking ROI on any marketing spend difficult. The process of discovering concrete5 to choosing to buy an add-on is too squishy and hard to track for me to justify spending dollars marketing concrete5, so today I dont. Id love to change that.

To address some of these issues, we want to change the way the marketplace works:

  1. 5% gross of any sale should go to a non-profit the customer picks from a list on checkout. Ive wanted to do this from day one but foolishly never did. Theres a clothing store here in Portland called Buffalo Exchange that gives you a wooden coin to put in one of three boxes if you dont need a bag. The boxes are each for a different charity that they cycle out monthly or so. They keep them very safe (no politics, religion, etc - stuff like shoes for kids or saving dogs). I believe that by doing this we will address two branding issues: First I believe peoples expectations about support from our add-on developers will be more reasonable. Second I believe the I cant believe this stuff costs MONEY crowd will have the sense to keep their mouths shut, or risk looking very cheap.
  2. 2% gross of your purchases above $1,000 should go back to customers as rewards credits. Use them for more marketplace purchases or just cash it out and buy a beer. This gives me something to say to the shops looking for a reseller/affiliate/commission type deal.
  3. To make those happen, wed ask marketplace developers to give up a 30% cut instead of the 25% we ask today. ;) Seriously though, this is one of those places where making it up on volume actually works. These changes and the ecosystems changes will make me feel comfortable spending money marketing concrete5 (which doesn't happen today.)
  4. Were not going to call it a Marketplace any more. It's simply the community, as we now will have the free hosting site as well.
  5. Our Add-ons - were going to start selling fewer things in the marketplace. Some of our stuff should just be free at this point (superfish??). Some of our stuff will be rendered obsolete with 5.7 (discussions and calendar). With eCommerce we plan on having a basic free version, a $95 version that is a bit simpler to use than what we have today but is somewhat comparable, and a $295 version that includes complex product configuration and other goodies. Were going to start selling some themes as well.

Ecosystem Changes

We are speaking to many disparate audiences with one site at Adding the site has been very helpful, and was a no brainer we should have done a long time ago. Enterprise CMS solutions are licensed in the low-mid 6 figure range, so it just doesnt make sense to put any of the tools were working on for large clients into our marketplace at Same goes with the support SLAs that are important.

A similar problem exists for consumers vs designers & developers at If Im a small business comparing concrete5 to the DIY web builder market it just doesnt make as much sense at as it could. Sure theres an instant setup link buried at the top of the page, but that is just a demo that we cant easily upsell into a hosting account.

To clear it all up:

  1. Redesign to feel more like a developer/designer community (bit cleaner design with a tad less whimsy). Improve the features around finding a community member and posting a job, but keep all that free. Focus more on documentation, including general cleanup and improved API documentation.
  2. Launch to be one click install of concrete5 for free at Much like wordpress, offer free hosting on a cloud server with ads for ever. Want to lose the ads? Click a built in promo to one of our hosting customers and have your site packed up and moved automatically (see business changes).
  3. Make, .com, and the app itself work with Facebook and Twitter authentication. Also make 1-click installs at automatically connected to project pages without you having to do anything. Getting a site on would automatically make or use a user account on Theres just far too many logins required for people to understand today. Under the hood we kind of need it to work that way, but theres no reason we cant take some of the pain out of setting things up for the majority of new folks.
  4. Were debating just making a new site. With the new Conversations model weve got some real issues with our forums here (which are a one off). Were also starting to think that some of the legacy content in this site is going to be irrelevant with 5.7. Cleaning house is always appealing, and building a new site we can test in a sane way sounds nice too. Theres certainly no perfect answer here, but were entertaining any option at this point.

My Account & Social Networking

With the introduction of the Grid, all default concrete5 installs basically have a social feed built right in. To pull that off right were going to bundle discussions and events right into concrete5 as well. Right now we sell add-ons for both, but these are just features we believe the majority of sites will benefit from and Im willing to trade the revenue for growth. Discussions will get re-architected into Conversations which will have their own flat (read: performance optimized) structure in the core.

Just like Files, Users and Pages, conversations will have their own permissions and be easily centrally managed from the dashboard. Conversations will be organized with Topics - which amount to tags with hierarchy. Topics can have permissions applied. The result is you will be able to make topic relationships like this:

+--Peanut butter

+--Peanut Butter

A conversation could be posted to Vegans, Fruit, Apples, etc. A person could be subscribed to any or all of those topics, or might not have permissions to see Meat at all. Conversations will be joined to pages through topics and a page ID reference.

Members will also have Relationships. These are typed connections between people. We will have a few out of the box and as a developer you can make more. Think Twitter follows vs Facebook confirmed friends, etc. Community points will be built in. Member profiles and member search will be more flushed out and easy to use.

The Grid

We started talking about this as The zine - a magazine made just for you but everyone pronounced it wine. I think the nod towards xeroxed zines from the 80s is appropriate. Take a windows 8 or flipboard style summary view, but give people enough control to curate their content. This should be a tool people want to tinker with.

We see using the grid layout for any number of UI challenges, so basically think of it as an alternate view layer for an improved page list block. We also want to make it so you can include 3rd party feeds in your grid. So you might include your company's facebook, twitter and youtube feeds in a community page, along with press releases youre posting to the site. Interacting with any of the tiles in the grid makes a page for it on your site so we can store whatever data is required. You should be able to post back to your grid, and have it auto-post to the same services it ingests content from. Add-ons could/should create tile layouts so they can be aggregated in this view. Grids can have automatic sorting, filtering and sizing logic - combined with curated tiles. Tiles can have conversations and events attached to them as free tools in the core.

We will use grids for the main landing page on the demo site, and for your My Account area as much as possible.

All of these are very loose creative direction:

More in the 5.7 plans...

Editing & Page Creation


This new text editor is cross browser compatible, makes clean HTML, is bootstrappy in its styling, and generally is totally awesome. Weve already integrated it with concrete5 so successfully that we can do text editing within the page instead of an overlay to our satisfaction.

This also works easily with the page in edit mode (skipping the click to put a specific block in edit mode), effectively giving us a middle edit state were going to use for other things later.

The only challenge were looking at here is what to do with legacy issues and TinyMCE. My own sense on this one is hey, you upgrade you lose old bad stuff and get sexy new stuff so if theres a strong argument for why concrete5 needs to support both editors, Id love to hear it.

As part of integrating redactor, weve been able to include a new snippits feature that amounts to Mail Merge in MSWord. You can pull in the current date, user name, page name, etc. Were architecting this in a flexible way so a developer might integrate with other data sources in handy ways.

Check out the video from a while ago...

Page Creation

Demoing editing a page on concrete5 always feels great, prospects just get it and quickly become clients. Demoing page creation is less awesome. Explaining to someone that your whole site is a tree and you have to goto the parent of where you want this page to be first is where they start to come back to earth and realize they need to pay attention. Composer starts to solve this problem a bit, but it also solves a completely different problem of making data entry screens for CRUD type problems. Adding more options rarely makes something less overwhelming. Were going to solve this problem by breaking it along more traditional lines:

1) What is composer today will mature into something that creates the scaffolding a developer needs to create a custom entry/edit UI in the dashboard. Use this for creating interfaces for inputting strongly typed content.

2) What is Add a Sub Page today will mature into something more geared for drafting as you go. You can add content from anywhere, you start writing (with auto-save) before you have to decide what it is youre making or where youre going to want to publish it. There will be mobile and browser toolbar versions of this Create tool.

New Add Block Interface

Adding a block will be as simple as dragging its icon from the Add Block toolbar into an area at the exact point you wish it to display.

Page Types

The fact that sometimes page types exist for layout and sometimes as an object model is not great. Someone should be able to add a calendar event or a blog post, and also switch its form factor. Were going to introduce a new concept called Feature that we can use to quickly determine if a page contains certain types of data for programmatic purposes. This should let us organically push page types towards the layout solution and de-couple functionality from requiring specific page types more. Blocks and add-ons could mark pages as implementing these Features, meaning that youll never have to choose whether a page is a Calendar Event or a Product Detail page type.


Were currently rewriting Layouts completely. The next version of Layouts will honor permissions and permissions inheritance correctly, be better integrated nto the concrete5 editing system, work correctly with area-specific developer methods, integrate better with themes, and be a bit more aware of modern style guidelines. Yes you can lock layouts and reuse them today, but it feels like a last minute feature. We want to make it easier for you to create snap to points so a site owners layout falls on common alignment lines.

Image Editor


We currently have three image editing solutions in concrete5. The avatar picker, the image sizer from composer, and the edit image from file manager. Some of them are Flash (ick). All of them suck. Were rebuilding all of these to be served by one attractive well thought out extendable image editor that the community can add filters/plugins to.

A sneak peak into the goals and vision for the next major release of concrete5.....

We're back! We talk news, karma, review PRB submissions and and answer your questions about our next big release, concrete5.7.

The Core Team is taking some time off for the holidays, so there will be no new Totally Random episodes until the new year. Check back in January to find out when the next live episode will air.

Happy Holidays and Happy New Year from the concrete5 Core Team.

Check out news, community karma winners (2:40), new marketplace themes and add-ons (5:55), and new work in GitHub (14:45).

We're back! This time we check out news, community karma winners (5:10), new marketplace add-ons (9:45), core code submissions from GitHub (15:20) and answer viewer questions (17:12).